T-Shirt Designers

[koto_stomp]

Hey everybody. Does anyone out there design their own t-shirts or know of any designers that are creating anything interesting? Thanks.

[acid_squid]

Good question. I'm about to get started on a t-shirting making company here in LA. I have no business experience but a decent amount of design experience.
I have a couple of steps to go before I actually start the printing and selling.

What inspired the question, Koto?

[koto_stomp]

yeah im thinking of designing a t-shirts for friends and was looking for some inspiration on getting started. Wanted to do something different away from the usual stussy, etc.

[smokingman]

I used to when I lived out in Texas. I still have some leftover and I'm starting to push them out here in Detroit where I live now. I had a moderate amount of success selling them, but stopped because I'm not much of a salesman. I hate going into a store and trying to talk up the owner and convince him to buy my stuff. I definately am going to get back into again though.

[acid_squid]

See, I haven't reached that stage yet of going in a trying to get space on the shelves. How hard is it? I imagine you'd get more resistance if you asked the stores to buy your shirts up front as opposed to waiting until the sale to give you the agreed-upon amount.

[peko-chan]

http://alliesoftherevolution.com/

These are done by an accquaintance of mine. He's doing pretty well for himself...peep his stuff in the GR Store. ;)

I make t-shirts just for the hell of it, limited runs of 24 or less.
Sometimes I like an image so much I want to wear it on my sleeve (or chest, as the case may be.) Sometimes I make shirts for my zine, in case my friends want to represent for me.

[ladybug]

http://www.snowday-sf.com

these are my friends. unfortunately they recently closed their shopping cart and are only available in shops now. interesting if not sweet if i may say so myself...bah, i just did.

[fad3r]

for shits and giggles, i make tshirts as well. i wore one of my creations to aniki's party with my avatar on it.

[YelloKitty]

i seen it! i thought that was dope. :)

[jardine]

Originally posted by Aaron
How about selling them online?
It'd be cool if you could get a bunch of different tshirt designers online selling out of the same store.
You share the website overhead and everyone just does their own shipping.
One stop shopping for designer t shirts.

I'll build the site.

http://www.threadless.com does something like that? I mean, with people submitting t-shirt designs and stuff. Slightly different than what Aaron's proposing, but it seems like a cool site anyhow.

[peko-chan]

Originally posted by Aaron
How about selling them online?
It'd be cool if you could get a bunch of different tshirt designers online selling out of the same store.
You share the website overhead and everyone just does their own shipping.
One stop shopping for designer t shirts.

I'll build the site.

www.fabric8.com is kind of on those lines....bay area represent!

[Ryan]

check out
http://www.zakkacorp.com/

its a toy/design/whatever store near chinatown. they have this thing called tshirt museum where people can submit designs and if they like it, theyll sell it for ya. ive seen some cool stuff there..

[smokingman]

The online store is a great idea. Rent is so much cheaper on the internet especially if it's split like Aaron mentioned. If it gets rolling I am definately interested.

[acid_squid]

Hmmm.... actually I'm doing the site-splitting thing with 2 friends right now. I designed the site and paid for the costs (which are really not that big of a deal) and put up their work to bring in bigger projects. I've never linked to my site on GR for whatever reason, but this is a cool thread, so here goes.
http://www.blipsofacto.com

The other thing I was gonna say is that you can hire a rep to get your shirts out to stores. They take a commission for every shirt sold and do all the driving around. Usually they rep a bunch of lines so that their days are full. You can find listings like the ones on the ASR site:

http://www.asrbiz.com/actionsportsretailer/business_resources/classifieds_results.jsp?vnu_listed_date=&vnu_publication_date=&vnu_keyword=&vnu_results_page=1&vnu_classified_category=POSITIONS+WANTED&submit=submit

[tangent23]

My friend Kab and his girlfriend Sooz set up a shop here[Australia] a few years ago, he started by selling t-shirts, she did jewellery, then did a government course where they taught you how to run a business and stuff. He's doing pretty well now, getting other designers as well to design stuff, shirts, hoodies, jackets, caps, visors, patches and stuff...

area101 (http://www.area101.com.au) [which reminds me: ThatGirlJing >> sorry i haven't sent stuff yet, moving to a new place and also out of ink for me printer >> coming soon!]

[5.92]

Originally posted by koto_stomp
Hey everybody. Does anyone out there design their own t-shirts or know of any designers that are creating anything interesting? Thanks.
Me hopefully soon:D I'd like to hear/see some of your ideas.

[mpyre]

I have a shirt line on the side. We're taking a breather to figure out where our economy is heading and thinking of online strategies.

We decided to do our own line (me and my biz partner) after seeing others make millions off of our artwork.

We still do designs for others, but we save the good ideas for ourselves.

Our next plan is maybe do ASR this fall.

We do it for fun and not to make dough. Heck, we could have bought a house or several cars with what we've spent on doing our own line but we'd go crazy if we never tried.

[acid_squid]

Mpyre- would you say you can make a career out of it? And if so, how long did it take to start up before the money started coming in instead of just flowing out?

[mpyre]

Originally posted by acid_squid
Mpyre- would you say you can make a career out of it? And if so, how long did it take to start up before the money started coming in instead of just flowing out?

We've made our money back since we keep our costs low...but if you want to really make a career out of it or earn some huge dough, you're going to have to have a lot of $$$. One of our mentors from Australia gave us a lot of good advice and his advice is NOT to start a line unless you have the money to really go big. Takes money to make money, I guess.

Our line was always something on the side. We get most of our money from doing freelance work. We do this for all the great benefits that we value...setting our own hours, having time to learn new stuff.

As for the shirt thing, I wouldn't really consider it a career. What's nice for us is the stuff we created is our own.

[emilie]

i like a lot of the shirts that Breakbeat Science has put out... they've used Ryan McGuiness, , LASE, Jeff Staple, Eden (duel industries), etc.

i also like www.threadless.com

[acid_squid]

For what it's worth, I just filled out my CA Seller's Permit so that when I visit the American Apparel building they won't think I'm a poseur out for some free samples but instead a real businessman... or something. Anyone else got 1 of these permits?

[5.92]

Originally posted by smokingman
The online store is a great idea. Rent is so much cheaper on the internet especially if it's split like Aaron mentioned. If it gets rolling I am definately interested.
Yeah same here. When we throw our big parties, 800-1000 people, we usually have space available for people to sell their stuff. I'm designing new logos for our house and have my own designs ready to be put on a silkscreen. If any of you want to slang shirts at the GR party in June, which so far is going to be in June, let me know whats up.

[mpyre]

Originally posted by acid_squid
For what it's worth, I just filled out my CA Seller's Permit so that when I visit the American Apparel building they won't think I'm a poseur out for some free samples but instead a real businessman... or something. Anyone else got 1 of these permits?

We use American Apparel for our girls tees. Their bodies are awesome but not good if you want to get into cheap stores. Our tees have been in stores like Fred Segal's.

As for American Apparel, there's a cool Filipino Fob chick working in the warehouse. I don't know if she's still there, but she hooked us up with free samples and made ordering very easy.

I think it was because she had a crush on my Vietnamese business partner. He's a chick magnet for sure.

[yellowtoothpick]

i make shirts and things. my business is really, really small. but it's fun and that's what matters. i have all the fancy paper work done so i have my business license and my sellers permit.

i've had my stuff in a couple of small random stores that just emailed me out of nowhere, i am a totally horrible salesperson. so mostly it's just me and my website.

i'd like to make it a full time deal. but i don't see that happening. i thought about getting a small business loan, but what a pain. i think i'll just stick with having it a side thing for now.

here is my site. (http://www.yellowtoothpick.com)

[mangamonster]

Originally posted by bjorktress


that's rad.

keep me informed of this :).

Yeaah, me too. I've been fiddling around with some t-shirt designs (hopefully will have plenty of finished ones by end of apr) and I have a partner who's putting up the funds for the business. We've already purchased our domain and company name, but as far as the small details of running it and shipping to customers, we still are kinda clueless; no experience:(
We're both techies, so web design isn't really an issue...Yellow, you mind if I email you for some business related help if needed?

[yellowtoothpick]

Originally posted by mangamonster


Yeaah, me too. I've been fiddling around with some t-shirt designs (hopefully will have plenty of finished ones by end of apr) and I have a partner who's putting up the funds for the business. We've already purchased our domain and company name, but as far as the small details of running it and shipping to customers, we still are kinda clueless; no experience:(
We're both techies, so web design isn't really an issue...Yellow, you mind if I email you for some business related help if needed?

yeah, no problem. i'll try to answer any questions you have. michelle@yellowtoothpick.com

[5.92]

Originally posted by yellowtoothpick
i make shirts and things. my business is really, really small. but it's fun and that's what matters. i have all the fancy paper work done so i have my business license and my sellers permit.

i've had my stuff in a couple of small random stores that just emailed me out of nowhere, i am a totally horrible salesperson. so mostly it's just me and my website.

i'd like to make it a full time deal. but i don't see that happening. i thought about getting a small business loan, but what a pain. i think i'll just stick with having it a side thing for now.

here is my site. (http://www.yellowtoothpick.com)
Yeah I remember you advertising here about your ad in GR. Hope things are working out. You need to post the pic of your mayor again. That guy rUlz!

[fad3r]

anyone know where i can pick up bulk t-shirts for cheap, like less than $5 each shirt? i picked up some $4 shirts at champs/foot locker yesterday.

[Robocon^^]

You should be able to find a local wholesale distributor in your phonebook. If you order in bulk the shirts can go down to 2-3 dollars per shirt for Hanes Beefy T's.

[Lain]

In highschool I made silk screen for shirt of some strange shit. I still have my http://www.ccsd.net/schools/lied/orchestra/tutorials/Images_music/coda.gif t-shirt, a few of my bar code tee's and tank tops. I need to by a silk screen making kit so I can make one design I made. I'll try to post a picture of it this afternoon when I can get to the image.

[kaijusan]

if you're serious about starting a clothing company, I highly recommend scoping out the competition in depth. a good place to start is the POOL tradeshow - it runs concurrently to the big MAGIC show in Vegas. the next one is at the end of August.

check out: http://www.pooltradeshow.com

the last show in Feb was really packed full of talent, just some stellar brands there. What's great is that they don't require you to register to get in, so if you're just trying to feel out the market - it's an easy way to see what's what. one caveat, it's beginning to get packed full of more established brands (like pony & royal elastics & penguin) - but the majority are great small companies that are trying to scratch their way into the big picture: red5, filter, groop, ok47, upper playground, etc.

As for ASR - I'd skip it, especially if you're a small guy, just too easy to get lost there.

Also, 2K is a great label that does some pretty straight shit with artists like doze & chris johansen, etc.

http://www.2ktshirts.com

last, make sure your work stands out in the marketplace - there's so many companies out there using essentially the same visual vocabulary. that whole modern urban apocalypse style is being tapped by everyone, small to big & some of them are doing a damn good job.

good luck and have fun with it!

[yellowtoothpick]

Originally posted by 5.92

Yeah I remember you advertising here about your ad in GR. Hope things are working out. You need to post the pic of your mayor again. That guy rUlz!

it's working out pretty ok. i am putting out another ad in the next gr. it's my 4th..it's been like a year since i've had money to put an ad out though, so i'm stoked.

here is the most awesome picture of my mayor:


http://yellowtoothpick.com/lj/fozzie.jpg

[kamenriderv3]

:)

http://www.cityoftemecula.org/images/council/jeff2.gif

waka waka waka *ear wiggle*

[el bombastico]

does anybody know any good links about t-shirt making? I know how to silkscreen but I'd like to know what paints are good for durability, sheen, etc.

[veggiesomething]

Originally posted by yellowtoothpick


it's working out pretty ok. i am putting out another ad in the next gr. it's my 4th..it's been like a year since i've had money to put an ad out though, so i'm stoked.

here is the most awesome picture of my mayor:


http://yellowtoothpick.com/lj/fozzie.jpg

how much does gr charge for ads? i emailed them last year for the info and they never got back to me. i just assumed that they were already booked. or maybe it was so expensive that if you had to ask, you couldn't afford it.

[ninjaKid]

i'm makin shirts on cafepress (with the help of the lovely and talented yellotoothpick), but the thing that sux about them is that they only offer white and grey shirts . . . :-p

-ad

[acid_squid]

good info, Kaijusan.
The situation I'm dealing with is that I have the concepts and some sketches but I am not keen on my artwork. I'd like to hire someone else to do the final versions with a lot of guidance from me... but the people I've talked to all want royalties and wouldn't want to give me full ownership and the freedom to alter the images as I need to. I can understand them wanting to make money for each use and maintain some control over their artwork... but it's my idea and it's too weird to give up complete control to someone else who puts a couple of hours into the art...

What do you think?

Also, I'm paranoid of my artwork being totally ripped off (once it's done and out there in stores) so I want to patent the designs... but I read that you kinda have to hire an IP attorney and then filing for patents costs about $600. Patents are stronger legal documents than copyrights but they expire after 17 years.

feedback?

[kaijusan]

acid squid -

1) forget about patenting. The best you can do is to copyright and trademark. Even this is expensive. Paul Frank, for example, copyrights and trademarks every design they make - in every country they sell the design. SERIOUS money. For the most part, you need to just get out there and do what you can & expect to be ripped off. Take GROOP for example, that poor dude has been ripped off by EVERYONE, friggin' LEVI's is stealing his images.

The only way not to be ripped off is to do your work in a totally unique style that stands out completely from the crowd. You have to make it so that if someone rips you off it's super-obvious & turns and bites them on their ass.

I mean, if someone tried to duplicate Dalek for example, they'd be screwed. However, that doesn't mean that Dalek doesn't tm & © his designs.

2) hiring artist to help out. This is a much easier question. Think of yourself as a company that's hiring an artist to do some work. I worked as an art director for a toy company for 5 years - did I own any of the work I did for them? No.

You just need to find the right person, or people, and have them work for you. I suggest paying a flat fee per design, no matter how many revisions. It keeps things simple. Forget a percentage - on the scale that you're talking about it just ends up with everyone being pissed off.

Also, have the artist sign a contract that spells out that you (or your corporation) own the artwork and can do whatever you want with it.

christ, if it worked for robert longo, it can work for you.

[acid_squid]

Kaiju- I just emailed you from here. Not sure how that works.
Robert Longo rocks. What ever happened to him? Jeff Koons still has his artslave assembly line rolling along.

Have any of you guys had custom tags made for your shirts?
Or does anyone know where to get them, prices and other things that might be good to know.
Thanks.

[kaijusan]

there are a variety of tag manufacturers out there. you might be able to get a good list out of google. CBF is a company that we've used in the past. We've moved on for various reasons & I guess I can give them a half-hearted thumbs up. 714-730-8087, ask for Shannon

another good place to find resources like that is at the ISS show in long beach. You only have to go to it once to get all the contacts you need for life. it runs in January.

you can actually get a lot of info just off their web site & look at exhibitors:

http://issshows.com/shows/long_beach/exhibitor_directory/2003.php

if none of that tickles your fancy, check out:

http://www.thealexanderreport.com/dir/labelshangtags/

[fad3r]

kaijusan: thanks for all the helpful advice! i've been wondering about those cusomt tags for a while.

Yea, thanks a bunch kaijusan! Very helpful.

[kaijusan]

you know what, I realized I didn't tell you what to expect with minimums. you pretty much have to do 5000 pcs. you'll also have a one-time art charge of $50 - $100. all in all, labels are a pretty cheap way to class up your product.

the next lesson has to do with getting the labels onto your shirts. let me know if you want to know how to get that done...

[falcor]

i made tshirts for some of the ny bots for xmas. got them at http://www.shirtwholesaler.com - they've got fruit of the loom, hanes and other brands, as well as girl-sized tshirts, tank tops, etc. (a little more expensive) and i skimmed through the rest of the pages so i dunno if american apparel was mentioned yet. the thing with them is that you need a tax id. i'm still working on that - they've got a good range (huge!) of styles and colors. they've even got doggy tshirts.

check out http://www.thequietlife.com (i think they still got some tshirts) and also http://www.kadorable.com - you subscribe and get a tshirt every couple of months or so but that shit is about $130/year or something. ouchy. also, as mentioned before, 2ktshirts has some good stuff, as well as links to other sites.

[falcor]

oh about copywriting - what about that 'poor man's copyright'? (bleh?) my friend said that for his music he'd make copies on cds and send them back to himself via certified mail - any info?

[akuma]

http://www.est00.com/hss.jpg

[akuma]

i want this one

http://www.thegiantpeach.com/clothing_labels/gallery_5024/nate_vandyke_grey_shirt.gif





more here (http://www.thegiantpeach.com/clothing_labels/gallery_5024/)

Originally posted by falcor
oh about copywriting - what about that 'poor man's copyright'? (bleh?) my friend said that for his music he'd make copies on cds and send them back to himself via certified mail - any info?

I think I remember reading that this doesn't work anymore in some other thread. Too easy to fake it or something like that.

[captain beeheart]

akuma - what's the est00 website all about? I can't seem to find the t-shirts on there... do they sell them?

[acid_squid]

I think it only costs $30 per image for an official copyright. Small price to pay for peace of mind? There's an excellent article in the LA Weekly by Monah Li about the fashion industry and her bizarro experiences. Check it
http://www.laweekly.com/ink/03/20/style-li.php

[falcor]

est00 is akuma's website.

[j tea cozy]

I just met with a rep from American Apparel and saw the whole line of shirts they had. I really dug the quality of material, and the prices aren't bad.

I hear that these guys, http://www.tshirtplace.tv, will do a limited printing order (12) for a good price.

[cellardoor_sf]

Please tell how to get labels onto shirts. I have a few dozen blanks and am screening a shirt for friends. If it's not too costly, I think labels would be nice.

[kaijusan]

there are three ways to do it. 1) get it done from the people you buy your shirts from 2) with luck, your silkscreener has connections and will take care of it if you ask. 3) pick up the phonebook and look under apparel or packaging for a relabeller/packaging solutions company. In every major city there is at least one company that does this exclusively - meaning, they'll open the seam, take out the labels, put in your label and sizing info, and resew the seam. They'll also do tagging and prepacking if you need them to. For example, in San Francisco - Complete Packaging is such an outfit. Relabeling should cost no more than $.30 a shirt & can drop to $.15 or even be free depending on how many you're doing and at what point in the process you do it.

[cellardoor_sf]

Thanks kaijusan--one more question: how can i find shirts with a thinner neck line? Do they cost a lot more?

What are people's favorite designers out now? Personally, I like Toro Vestimenta a lot, and mumbleboy too.

[kaijusan]

it depends on your volumes, for small runs, just work through your printer - they should have a hook with all the blanks distributers out there and they can show you a good variety. If you're looking for a larger run & to do steady business, the best thing is to set up an account with one of the big distributors like TSC.

of course, the other thing is to look at your competition and figure out what they're using....

[cellardoor_sf]

I am screening my own with a Print Gocco.

[kaijusan]

ahh, excellent. a man or woman after my own heart. sigh, the smell of acetone, the joy of misregistration. well, here's the deal. american apparel is one of the few manufacturers you can buy from direct. I'm sure you've seen their shirts - 2K, Groop, christ, just about everyone uses their men's blanks. The nice thing about them is that they're fitted and have a pretty slim neck band. they also have a pretty savvy color pallet. The difficulty with them is that they don't take ink well, also, compared to other brands out there - they shrink somewhat. additionally, they are considerably more expensive than other brands. last, AA has a poor reputation for shipping on time, also their customer service (when you really start working with them) is less than stellar - a lot of "i'll check on that" and then you never hear from them again.

Ok, so you've decided that you don't want AA - now you're looking at anvil or hanes, or fruit or m&o - however, you have to work through one of their distributors. TSC is one of them, there are 3-4 more. These guys are pretty cool & will sell to you if you're small, but they'll need payment right away - either credit card or cod. BTW, if you're setting up a business, you could do worse than starting your credit history with a big company & working to get some terms & paying your bills on time.

BTW, if you guys want - i'd be happy to set up an "ask kaijusan" thread that focuses on the business aspects of art & design - with special attention to the fashion end of the biz. for some reason I'm finding this whole Q&A thing rather relaxing & a pretty effective stress buster.

[mangamonster]

Kaijusan - I think thats a good idea. Although I have yet to ask u anthing in regards to tshirt design, that's exactly the business I'm in the process of setting up. You've actually answered a lot of my questions that others have asked and find this thread kick ass because of that. Right now I'm setting up the billing process and shipping procedures for our site before we fully go online...not sure if you have a lot of experience in that area, but anything would help. I'd hate to go through some vendor, ie ibill, that charges up to 15% fees on total profits, sucky. I've ordered some shirts from Customink.com and awaiting the shipment with my design...they worked really well with me when including the specific fonts and what-not.

[acid_squid]

Advice as stress release excercise!
Sounds good and you don't have to wear those silly Yoga tights!!

I'd like to know more about the Print Gocco. I checked one out at the local art store last week. Is it just a cute hobby thing or can you actually use it to do quality small-run t-shirts? meaning-
1. can you use ink that will work well on fabric?
2. does a t-shirt fit in it to be printed?
3. is it that hard to keep things in registration?

KAIJUSAN for PRESIDENT

[kaijusan]

I gotta confess - i'd never heard of a print gocco until this thread. My experience comes from a more traditional silkscreening background with burning screens and squegeeing ink, etc. I think you can still get a basic screeing kit that'll work with shirts & fabric ink for cheap. Seems like the Gocco isn't recommended for t-shirts, but I haven't had direct experience with it.

here's a quote from the gocco web site:

Printing T-shirts directly on the B5HM Kit, for example, would be difficult given the possibility that you might be unable to print in the desired location without the material "bunching up" in an area. However, the clear transparent sheet on the master could be removed allowing you to apply screen printing ink to the fabric using the squeegee technique. While this approach lays down only one color at a time, many users will add color to the printed design using fabric markers or paints.

- once I get a minute later tonight I'll start up a new thread.

[veggiesomething]

hope this helps...

http://www.giantrobot.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=9075&highlight=gocco

[cellardoor_sf]

The best thing I can say about the PG is that you can screen anywhere on the shirt. So a lot of my designs involve using the entire shirt instead of just the center, or thinking of the entire shirt as a space to be taken in by a viewer, rather than looking solely at the design.

Registration is kind of difficult, but it can be done. It depends on what kind of image you are doing; like all screening, part of the beauty of it is knowing that it has been touched by human hands and that it'll never be absolutely perfect. I do mostly silhouettes, so I don't worry so much about registration unless I'm layering images.

My Dad was a printmaker until he couldn't support us with just his art, so I grew up helping him screen, waiting for him to shoot positives, and smelling turpentine. Registering prints on paper is definitely easier. I don't have a means of accessing silkscreening equipment, because I mostly design and screen shirts for groups in my college. But yeah, the PG is good, portable, makes a good product. A caveat: you need to buy thicker inks if you want to screen onto dark fabrics.

[cellardoor_sf]

I just checked out AA--their shirts look nice but they're expensive. I went through blankshirts.com for my first shipment and they worked out to around 2.50 each, which I though was pretty good considering I didn't order a thousand or anything that big.

[cellardoor_sf]

The shit I do on my own, recently, I like to play around with the idea of making a viewer look at the space of a shirt as something more than empty space. Like I screened the silhouette of a fisherman holding a pole on the upper right corner of a baby blue shirt and put a little school of fish on the lower left corner.

But for commissioned stuff, like the shirts I did for the tennis team and for the campus center's pool tournament, then I have to think more about conventional parameter; what is going to effectively communicate what the shirt is about and all that.

Kaijusan--do you have a store or stuff that's in stores? Or do make your living doing other graphic design? If you're in SF or nearby I'd love to get lunch with you or something this summer.

[veggiesomething]

i usually specify the dimensions of the design before i design it. then i would print and cut it out and put it on the shirt to make sure that it's the size that i want. i normally don't have to make any size adjustments. but if i did, i can always scale my design a bit, which is quite easy to do in adobe illustrator.

the actual placement of the design on the shirt depends on where you place the screen.

[kaijusan]

puppy - yes, we use a template that we pass to the printer to show exactly where everything's suppose to go. also, we use a similar template for sales & in house for design critiques.

cellardoor - yes, we sell to many stores. I am in SF, but my time is limited. I'd be happy to answer any questions you have in this forum or, if you prefer, you can email me directly - check my user profile. also, 2.50/pc is pretty darn good for a couple dozen shirts.

[kaijusan]

well, it's changed over time, but it's essentially just a drawing of the shirt shape done in illustrator.

this is a bit more complicated, but we also manufacture a bunch of cut n sew & for that we start with sketches & then move to prototypes & then take photos & then make drawings from the photos for sales & pr & manufacturing.

[kaijusan]

depends on the level of detail you're looking for. for basic design placement, you can have a pretty rough template. but if you're being fancy, then, yeah - get out that tape and start measuring.

[veggiesomething]

the place the i use recommends no full widths greater than 10.5 inches. otherwise, it may wrap under the arms for smaller shirts. if you are using bigger shirts, you should be able to go bigger obviously.

the place also recommends you to set the dpi to at least 300 at actual size before you start your design for raster images. otherwise, you may have jaggies. and make sure you set it *before* you design. if you convert it later, you may get jaggies. also, if you used a vector based program like illustrator, you wouldn't have to worry about the jaggies at all and you can resize as many times as you like.

[moishe]

http://www.craigslist.org/sfo/ats/10374389.html

I wrote this guy and just got a reply. The store is well known if you're an esseffite. Sounds like it would be good exposure for anyone starting out.

[el bombastico]

kaijusan,
would you please break down the basic pro's and cons of silkscreening vs. machine printing? I'm itching to make some shirts(on a small scale)and am wondering if I should invest in the silkscreening supplies(and mess and hassle)or if I should should start considering printers.

thanks.

[-minus_one]

Originally posted by el bombastico
kaijusan,
would you please break down the basic pro's and cons of silkscreening vs. machine printing? I'm itching to make some shirts(on a small scale)and am wondering if I should invest in the silkscreening supplies(and mess and hassle)or if I should should start considering printers.

thanks.
you didn't really ask me but having experience i'll just say i love the art of screenprinting. it was my major in art college and the satisfaction of knowing that you alone were responsible for finished product was pretty cool. i guess the big thing now is water based inks, they are easier to use for home printing thats for sure. so i guess i'm saying if you are into the "zen" of screening you will always want to do it yourself. printers are also an option and having worked in a shop as printer and designer i know that if you find a reputable small time printer and they do a good job then go for it. often times small shops will do minimum runs of 12. i don't screen for a living anymore but the last few weeks i've been asking for and getting overtime work in the shop (architectural enviromental signage) screening. as i type my hands have ink on then and my arms and back feel heavy, but knowing i still have "it"
is a good feeling.

[kaijusan]

ok, so it's 2 in the morning and I'm drunk. goddamn it, emies spaghetti shack has got to be the best restaurant in SF ever. I'll fight you if you think different. and then we went to the argus, which isn't my favorite place, but the bartendress was wearing a superchunk tee - which is just the best, however, no one in the bar had seen battle royal & I spent most of the night trying to explain it & no one believed me.

so, back to the question at hand. I concurr with minus_one. we print in a small shop. I personally oversee every print run. it's a hands on business & if you remove yourself from the process, the work suffers.

we print mostly on an automatic. this is a machine that uses the silkscreen process, but is automated and can whip out a large number of prints per hour. However, it's reallllllllly important to have a good operator. I swear to god, I live at the printer for the weeks it takes to get my line printed. I sweat over every impression and make sure that our quality is the best. Whew, feeling a little tipsy.

I'm not sure that I want to start a new thread as I don't want to come off as a know it all asshole. you guys seem like a good crew. if you have more questions, I'll answer them. otherwise, I'll just fade into the sunset.

[mpyre]

We used the best printer in OC for our shirt line. He had recently left a major printing company and his stuff was really good.

I'm going to try to contact him next week. I know he was printing for major lines but had moved over to music industry clients (because they paid better and weren't major hassles). I'll find out if it's OK for me to mention his company in this forum. I don't know if he's needs the work. His minimum is usually a run of a dozen dozen (144+). Anything smaller and he charges more.

His only problem with getting our line done was during the sampling season. The 2 months before ASR or Magic show are the worst times for small lines to get their shirts printed,

I've found a new printer down in San Diego. We're helping him out by getting some of our OC clients to use him. Hopefully he'll give us a good deal when we do new shirts this fall.

We decided to take a break from doing our line a few months back when the whole Iraq thing came up.

OK. Back to Zelda.

[mangamonster]

Originally posted by moishe
http://www.craigslist.org/sfo/ats/10374389.html

I wrote this guy and just got a reply. The store is well known if you're an esseffite. Sounds like it would be good exposure for anyone starting out.

Damn, I would send all my designs their way but I'm in Texas, not the Bay Area....erghghgh!

[acid_squid]

cool.
I read the gocco threads and decided they're ideal for postcards and printing the covers of zines and comic books... but not ideal for anything else. So, I bought some packs of ink jet iron-on paper so that I can print out the artwork and stick it on some blank t's just to see how the stuff looks/show it to local stores.

My first series is totally unauthorized shit that I could never legally sell, so it'll just be for my own entertainment. I'll post the images here and try out the iron-on's tonight. It has to do with Gary Gygax.

best bar in SF- C Bobby's Owl Tree
best Dunken Master- Kaijusan
this thread rocks!

[acid_squid]

FINALLY!!
tell me what you think.
http://www.blipsofacto.com/pics/mos.jpg

[acid_squid]

Here's design #2. I thought I'd be incurring the wrath of 2 companies with this one, but it turns out Wizards of the Coast owns all the TSR stuff and Hasbro owns Wizards of the Coast and Pokemon...
http://www.blipsofacto.com/pics/twerp.jpg

[vegAsian]

dude,
i'm pretty fuckin hyped.
i'm takin a screen printing class 2nd summer term!
i did screening in middle school and in hs, so it's
been a while. i hope to work on some sweet
mixed media pieces, posters, and shirts =)

[maple]

Originally posted by acid_squid
Here's design #2. I thought I'd be incurring the wrath of 2 companies with this one, but it turns out Wizards of the Coast owns all the TSR stuff and Hasbro owns Wizards of the Coast and Pokemon...
http://www.blipsofacto.com/pics/twerp.jpg


design #2 = greatness.

Reminds me of some of those old Melvins posters.
Please tell me when you wind up making these shirts.

[kaihentai]

This thread rocks...

Does anybody recommend iron on transfer making! One time I got to intern for a day at a shop, and what they would do is make screenprints in reverse onto iron on transfers. So they only
ironed on the exact quantity asked. I guess this leads to the question about those hot presses. Is there such thing as a small one to try for a startup. I think they look like the presses that they use in dry cleaners.

[acid_squid]

Kai- I asked my printer about those transfers and he said they don't hold up to wash and wear like a direct print on the fabric does. But if you're going for really short runs, I think that's the only way you can do it. I think that's how they do it at cafepress.com

See below for my newest concepts... not sure which one works better/is funnier. Lemme know what you think.
http://www.blipsofacto.com/pics/spocks.jpg

[kaihentai]

squid, liked the black and white one. It's more distinct.

[veggiesomething]

yes. the black one does look more oldschool emo. are you going to print that design on shirts?

[acid_squid]

I dunno what legal issues I'd get tangled in if I printed a shirt with the image of Spock on it... but I did make an iron on of the B&W version last night and am going to test out its powers at the Postal Service show tonight.

[mangamonster]

yeah, black and white image looks good. you may want to dress his face up a bit with some shades and ear jewelry? that way you can claim it's not really spock..hehe. if you want to print his image on your clothing, you'll probably want to look into getting a license for mr spock

[maple]

http://www.simplyvintage.com/images/products/unisex/gnome-sorcery-federation.jpg

[filipEMO]

guys guys guys... unless youre planning on mass producing these prints for $ALE, then you have no problems... they cant nab you for printing your own shirt... it would be like them nabbing some guy for writing the word NIKE on a pair of payless joints... as long as its not for commercial purposes, then you're straight to but whatever the hell you want on a piece of cloth!! As long as it belongs to you... ;)

[RazeOner]

I havn't come accross a printed transfer yet that can stand up to multiple washes, though they have improved over the years. They now have silk-screened transfers but it still involves multiple screens for multiple colors. You save money by being able to transfer designs to shirts as you need them instead of having a huge stock of printed/finished t-shirts. Another advantage is placement of the designs and they look exactly like a regular screened prints.

[acid_squid]

But the thing with transfers is that you have to eyeball the placement each time, right? Is there a way to set things up so that you get the image straight and centered (or whatever the desired effect is) every time?

[doofer1]

i am about to go to print with some of my own t-shirts...i would definitely like to collaborate with other artists to market their products...i work in the L.A. apparel industry so i know a little bit of this and that. respond if you want to try something cool.

[evillilgirl]

I must come back to this thread when I have time to read it. See I am just about ready to come out with me and my girls label.
I'll be back.

<3 evil

[kaijusan]

squid - you may want to check out this shirt re: spock.

http://www.fabric8.com/bazaar/product.f8ml?PID=TK0107

[mangamonster]

http://www.fabric8.com/bazaar/images/TY0102_z.jpg pretty sweet shirts

[acid_squid]

hmmm... interesting that Spock is out there on a shirt already, throwing up gang signs and all. As far as my progress goes, this week was devoted to doing the DBA paperwork and officially copyrighting some of the images.

[kaijusan]

yup - trainwreck is a pretty small outfit based up here in sf. I met the owner & his gal at an industry party some time ago - very nice. I think they're struggling to define the brand's identity amidst the huge world of competing streetwear. they're also starting up a record label - whew, two ways to lose all your money, clothes & music. I wish them luck.

good work on the dba, squid. that shit can be grueling. btw, I gotta re-stress checking out your local small business bureau & also your local mayor's office of economic development. those guys can really help you raise money and get everything you need legally done. I just had another conversation with the mayor's office up here this week & we're looking at starting the qualification process for a pretty hefty package. I think more people would do it if they knew about it.

[inkmonsta]

i have been designing t-shirts with some of my characters on and selling a few on a small scale..i am hoping that soon i will be able to print them myself as opposed to paying somebody then i can get to experiment more.from what i've heard the process is a lot more expensive here than over in the states.that sucks!i'm workjing on a website,i'll let y'all know when it's up..
be interested to hear from anybody who's doing anything similar.

[evillilgirl]

I have a two panel deadline by next thursday. Dam... I don't know what to do either something simple and plush or complicated graffiti in another language.

[kinjo]

yeah man, ill be doing the same shizz, sell online get a paypal account. done. id sell my shirts in town but my town is small and gay. so i resort to online. i have nothing up yet but im working on gettin the shirts made at my friends silkscreen company.

hookups=good

[evillilgirl]

same here kinjo we are in the middle of no where. But our silk screener print guy travels almost every weekend out of town to clubs etc.. Plus he is an old friend. Also my partner used to live in Korea so she wants to send some stuff up there for her family to sell in some clubs just to get it out. Freelancing work is good but in the end working for yourself is even better. Goodluck to you kinjo maybe one day ours paths will cross.
Where are you located at kinjo?

[emperorTK]

I read at cafeexpress.com and on the copyright website that a work is copyrighted the moment it is created. Anyone else hear about this? Would this apply to a hacked image like spockrock?

[kinjo]

Originally posted by evillilgirl
Freelancing work is good but in the end working for yourself is even better. Goodluck to you kinjo maybe one day ours paths will cross.
Where are you located at kinjo?

hey evillilgirl. i live in canada, penticton, BC but im moving to Vancouver again in the fall for school.

[falcor]

ok i know i've asked and bitched about this a bunch of times but the post i was looking for is gone - what's the form number for the application i need to get a tax id?

[GalleryGirl]

I've recently decided that CafePress is a rip. If you already have a popular site and you link a CP shop to it, then fine you'll probably make a little money. If you don't, then it's slim pickins. My site has had 1700 hits in 3 months and only 6 buyers. CP won't pay you until you reach a profit of $25 and then it takes 45 days after the last order to get your check (because of their return policy) It's taken me 3 months to make $26.00 and they won't mail my check until August. On top of that.. if you don't sell $25 in 6 months then whatever you have sold gets forfeited to CP. Even if it's $24.50. Keep in mind that I pay $6/month for the site. Hmph. Anyone else learned this lesson before me?

[falcor]

no. that sounds shitty - saw your stuff on cut and paste - i love that site too! tho i imagine the sales from that site aren't great either. :(

[evillilgirl]

im not allowed to show any of my new designs yet.. i hope you guys like em' when i do tho'. I have been doing new work all since the beginning of this year and only updated my site just yesterday with two new pics, so im going to have a whole bunch of images to upload..=_=;

[filipEMO]

god i hate that!! I have like 30000003032 pictures to upload cause i finally got a card reader for my camera.. like 3 diff memory cards to empty.. geez.. :(

[acid_squid]

I did it, went to print with my art. I created a 3-color image in illustrator and emailed the file to Electric pencil. Meanwhile, I bought a dozen shirts from American Apparel- their standard t-shirt which is designed to take ink really well.

I handed the film over to Bucktoof, who got it to her dad to make the screens. And then today we met up at her parents' screen printing shop and went work. It took about 3 hours total- 2 1/2 hours of set up time and 30 min of actual printing. I kinda wish I'd bought more shirts to make all the set-up more worthwhile... but I'm also thinking I made need to go back to my files and add more space between shapes to account for ink bleed. Overall, the printing turned out really well... but there are a few spots where the shapes come together a little more closely than I expected.

This was my first time actually seeing the process- I watched and participated the whole day. It's a painstaking process- tweaking the alignment of all the screens, mixing the ink, etc, testing the image on scraps before putting the actual shirts on...

Tomorrow I'll show the shirts to a couple of buyers and get their reactions. Depending on what they say, I'll either re-work the image for greater clarity or press ahead and buy more shirts and make the labels which will be stickers with the company logo.

[fad3r]

Besides American Apparel, who else makes 100% combed cotton tees?

[moishe]

Originally posted by falcor
ok i know i've asked and bitched about this a bunch of times but the post i was looking for is gone - what's the form number for the application i need to get a tax id?

Isn't your Tax ID your SSN? http://www.irs.gov/individuals/article/0,,id=96287,00.html

Or were you talking about a reseller's permit/sales tax form?

[falcor]

i think that one - tax id as in, sales tax i think. i gotta apply for a small business permit.

[moishe]

In California the State Board of Equalization (http://www.boe.ca.gov/) handles sales tax. You're in NY, right? Here's their starter page: http://www.tax.state.ny.us/sbc/starting_business.htm

DTF-17?

[falcor]

hmm.. i'll look into it. thanks for the link!

[ironmonqui]

Where in the heck is the REGULAR t-shirt thread???


http://www.nosweatapparel.com/miva/graphics/00000001/masst-DET-FR.jpg

[jen_er_ator]

i've been on a crazy stencil frenzy over the past few days...

http://photos.yafro.com/pics3/i/20050629/20/0/2/d/02d21bcc7d9f4591b1cdb1d82dfcff9c0_full.jpg

http://photos.yafro.com/pics3/i/20050629/20/b/c/b/bcbf94e8f9c069bbe737cc8ca22e0ccb1_full.jpg

i need to tweak the second one a bit more.

i stumbled across this (http://www.stencilrevolution.com/homepage.php) site...people be doing some crazy shit with stencils!

[JLS]

^Good link. Nice work & tutorials @ Stencilrevolution. I'm loving this one.
http://stencilrevolution.com/photopost/data/502/real_Audrey_test.JPG

[CaptainPajamaShark]

anyone try the photoEZ (http://ezscreenprint.com/photoezstarterkithires.aspx) screenprinting kit to make tees? looks fairly simple to use -- there are some cool tutorials on youtube. think I might have to buy a kit.

[premium]

the photoEZ is basically a toy.

could be fun though.

[filipEMO]

whats wrong wift it? I don't have the space or desire to work with the photo emulsion stuff(cleaning is too much), so this seems to be the natural solution.

[premium]

for one, the plastic frame is 8.5" X 11".

that's toy.

if you want something screenprinted, just let me do it.

;)

[CaptainPajamaShark]

Originally posted by premium
for one, the plastic frame is 8.5" X 11".

that's toy.


unless you want a big ass print I don't see a problem with a 8.5"X11" print surface. i'd say the majority of my tees fall in this range.

[premium]

ok, for another, it uses the sun to expose the image.

i would recommend getting a photo bulb from a camera shop or somewhere like that.

dickblick.com maybe.

i built a light box out of .25" glass and a bunch of fluorescent UV bulbs to expose with.

[premium]

Emo's right, emulsion is a nasty business. It stains everything. My shop sink is permanently blue I'm afraid.

[CaptainPajamaShark]

Originally posted by premium
Emo's right, emulsion is a nasty business. It stains everything. My shop sink is permanently blue I'm afraid.

that's part of the appeal for me with the photoez kit -- less cleanup.

[CaptainPajamaShark]

while we're on the topic of screenprinting could someone answer a question for me? I read somewhere that when printing red inks on dark colors it's common practice to lay down a white ink first (let it dry) and then print the red on top so it stands out more. is this true?

[premium]

my dream setup has the cleanup station and the print station and the exposing station all in the same room.

right now i have to run to the basement every time i need to clean a screen.

adds a lot of tedium to the process.

i just did a job that needed 36 screens. by the end i had a made a ritual of the whole process and cut my time to a fraction of what it had been.

i could set a screen to expose for seven minutes, run upstairs, ink the screen, print the hoodie, reclaim the ink, carry the screen back downstairs, clean it and hang it up to dry. all before the exposure had finished.

[premium]

Originally posted by CaptainPajamaShark
while we're on the topic of screenprinting could someone answer a question for me? I read somewhere that when printing red inks on dark colors it's common practice to lay down a white ink first (let it dry) and then print the red on top so it stands out more. is this true?

yes, it's basically true for any color that you're printing on a dark material.

when you lay the white down, it really makes the color you print on top of the white a truer version of the color.

you can also do a process called discharge that bleaches the shirt where you are printing it. this gives you a brighter print.

both of these processes mean you need a multi-color press or else a very good method of lining up your screens from print to print.

matsui makes high opacity inks that look ok on dark colors. their white is amazing. it is on the same level as a plastisol ink but is still water soluble for cleanup.

tshirtforums.com is a great resource.

[CaptainPajamaShark]

cheers. i'd have a tee done professionally but since I only want a one-off it made more sense for me to do it myself. I found this company called Fresh Pressed (http://www.fresh-pressed.com/site2008/home.php) and they do one-offs as part of their business model. it's something like $40 for a single color tee. but I figured for $40 I might as well buy myself an inexpensive DIY kit and take the plunge, rather than pay someone else to do it. I think more companies should offer one-off tee services to the masses.

[premium]

i'll make a one-off one color tee for you for $25.

http://www.albcustoms.com

but, yeah, take the plunge man, it's fun!

my goal is to open a brick and mortar shop that makes one off tees.

something like neighborhoodies but with screenprinting instead of iron ons and embroidery.

i'd like to do all three, but for now, i'm focused on screenprinting.

[premium]

thanks for the link, capt.

[mumbot]

Yeah... thanks for starting this thread!

If you have a moment, please check out my t-shirt design!

http://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/11eb79ad25faa448


Thank you~

¢¾

[CaptainPajamaShark]

Originally posted by premium
i'll make a one-off one color tee for you for $25.

http://www.albcustoms.com

but, yeah, take the plunge man, it's fun!

my goal is to open a brick and mortar shop that makes one off tees.

something like neighborhoodies but with screenprinting instead of iron ons and embroidery.

i'd like to do all three, but for now, i'm focused on screenprinting.

gimme more details. i'm assuming you would do a proper ink screenprint? -- i'm not down with heat transfers or DTG printing. what kinda inks do you use? do you ship to out-of-state customers? what are my t-shirt and color choices? $25 sounds good but it almost sounds too good to be true.

[premium]

Originally posted by mumbot
Yeah... thanks for starting this thread!

If you have a moment, please check out my t-shirt design!

http://mail.google.com/mail/?shva=1#inbox/11eb79ad25faa448


Thank you~

¢¾

that link took me to my own gmail page, wtf.

[premium]

Originally posted by CaptainPajamaShark


gimme more details. i'm assuming you would do a proper ink screenprint? -- i'm not down with heat transfers or DTG printing. what kinda inks do you use? do you ship to out-of-state customers? what are my t-shirt and color choices? $25 sounds good but it almost sounds too good to be true.

tell me what you want and i'll tell you if it's possible.

i can get tultex, gildan, american apparel, anvil, etc. for shirts and hoodies.

the ink colors depend on what color they are being printed on, so i am limited somewhat in that regard.

i'll ship to anywhere, but shipping charges vary.

i use water-based inks. usually Holden or Matsui.

i can do plastisol too, but it's messier.

plasitol is a good choice if it's light ink on a dark shirt.

but, like i said, tell me what you want and i'll let you know if it's possible. odds are i can do it.

[mumbot]

Dammit, I don't know what happened before...

Here is the link to my t-shirt design again:

http://www.designbyhumans.com/vote/detail/40662

[CaptainPajamaShark]

Originally posted by premium
tell me what you want and i'll tell you if it's possible.

i can get tultex, gildan, american apparel, anvil, etc. for shirts and hoodies.

I specifically want Gildan ultra cotton.

the ink colors depend on what color they are being printed on, so i am limited somewhat in that regard.

it's pretty straightforward. the one tee I want printed should be red ink on a black tee. however, if I like the job you do I may want another one done with white ink on paprika.

i'll ship to anywhere, but shipping charges vary.

what method of shipping would you use? USPS would be ideal since they're less expensive than UPS. i'd also be open to you sending it 1st Class Mail to cut down on postage costs.

i use water-based inks. usually Holden or Matsui. i can do plastisol too, but it's messier. plasitol is a good choice if it's light ink on a dark shirt.


i'm not too fussy about either, just as long as the print is nice and won't disintegrate on me. but, if I were to have white ink on Paprika it might have to be plastisol. red ink on black however might need to be water-based. but, you're the expert.

now for the big question, if I was interested how would we go about doing this? do I contact you through your albcustoms.com site and set up specifics there? guess i'll need to know what the total cost will be, what sorta art specs you'll need, etc., before proceeding.

one last thing. if you did a one-off for me and someone was interested in buying a tee from me, how much would a reprint cost? I don't foresee this happening but it would be good to know these things just in case.

[premium]

I'll PM you.

[Goner]

Next time I get back to The Philippines, I'll definitely have to visit the Team Manila store.

http://teammanila.com/

They only have a limited number of designs for sale online. The ones I want can only be bought at their outlets.

[chromecables]

Vote for me if you like the tee! (http://www.designbyhumans.com/vote/detail/41605)

Thanks